January 29, 2009 6:47 AM
Rich wrote:
Galatians is finally making some sense to me. It is amazing to me how the Bible hits me at different times in my life. I can read the same passage or book every year and depending on circumstances at the time or other, what I take from my reading will change. The Bible truly is an amazing book - I firmly believe it is from God. And today I thank God for this gift that is able to teach us and guide us and help us when we need help (like always!!!).
I have learned from Galatians that I do not want to keep returning to what I used to do. I do not want to go back to rules and regulations. I instead want to move forward in my faith. I believe one of the hardest changes for me is to act out of love instead of out of duty or obligation. I am an obligation kind of guy. I go to work everyday because it is an obligation. Sometimes I think the main reason I have remained in my marriage for over 26 years is that I strongly believe in commitments. That is a good thing but it can also be a bad thing. The reason I should remain in my marriage is love not duty. Love is a much more effective and powerful motivator. I have noticed that as my marriage goes on and that as I mature and think more about these issues, I at least think about being motivated by love. I notice the same with God, however, as I said a few days ago, I have noticed also that stress and pressure in my life tends to drive me back to my old ways.
The last few verses in Galatians (that I have read numerous times) hit me very differently today. I want to be motivated by the spirit (by love for God) to not sin, not be motivated by fear or by the law. The law makes me aware of sin but actually as Paul says, sins are obvious. I do not need the law to know what offends God if I love God.
Today I am going to focus on being motivated by love instead of trying to do what is right and avoid doing what is wrong. Reply to this
January 29, 2009 10:44 AM
Johnbob wrote:
I agree with you - it's like Jesus is saying "You believe at last". Chapter 5 is a culmination of the theme for sure. It is basically saying that to be right with God, the key is not to focus on regulations and laws and a system. Now those of you who have been around awhile - is this not what the way the church was - not the extent of Galatians with their Judaic laws and celebrations, but it was through our dependence on authoritarian and hierarchical leadership (vs. the Spirit), numbers driven culture (vs. the Spirit), etc.
This is comparable to being in slavery - so that why many people were not happy ('what has happened to all your joy?).
It is interesting that he gives a sin list here. It is tempting to be legalistic when reading this. Here is a list - just check it off and you are ok. However, he preempts it by saying - hey sinful acts are obvious - you don't need a law to tell you about whether those are right or wrong - it is obvious. The way to overcome them? Focus on the Spirit. Keep in step with the Spirit. And the fruits of doing so are also obvious. The Christian Jews wanted to keep a system and set of laws to prove that they were right with God. Paul is saying - hey, you want to see who is right with God - look at the fruits of their lives. So do I exhibit the fruits of the Spirit? Some of them more than others, but self-control is probably the biggest weakness. Reply to this
How many times can any of you say that your faith has brought home the lost sheep of this world? i can honestly answer none. But i am just learning my faith and i am going to start searching for the lost sheep.
16So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature.
Live through the power of God and obey his commands and we will be able to resist sin. It's not easy to resist sin but with the help of our brothers and sisters and God we can overcome our downfalls.
22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
When we all get to the point were we can resist/overcome sin this is how our lives will be.
I am waiting on a call from Rick to find out if Tom Brown is going to okay my baptism for Sunday during the service. If it is ok'd i want to invite all of you to the service and my baptism. More information will follow once all plans are set.
Again if my opinions are off please let me know. I really want to make sure that i am on the right track. Reply to this
January 29, 2009 8:47 AM
Johnbob wrote:
Wow. You have really come a long way, Dustin. I am really happy for you, and you are making a great decision. Reply to this
January 29, 2009 8:25 AM
rik wrote:
This whole circumcision thing has always confused me. It must have been a big deal with Jewish custom. It is not such a big deal in our society today, but I think you could replace this custom and insert another in its place, one we struggle with today, and get an understanding of the heart behind what Paul is trying to say. Christening children, maybe? Or God parents? I think these are things that our society does today that takes away from the message of the cross. The only difference is these were never a part of God's Law like circumcision was. I am struggling to think of any other parallels for todays divisions. Do you guys have any ideas?
Btw, I am still having a difficult time getting over this stomach thing. Lots of aches and pains, fatigue and unsettled stomach. day 5. please pray. Reply to this
January 29, 2009 8:33 AM
rik wrote:
(LIGHT BUL 11Brothers, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished.
Brothers, if I am still preaching MY OLD WAY OF LIFE, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the WHOLE POINT OF THE CROSS has been WIPED OUT.
This thought also ties in with the sinful nature/spirit thing also. He is trying to get them to understand the pointlessness of returning to you old life. Reply to this
January 29, 2009 2:26 PM
Rich wrote:
I actually had what I think is a deep thought today concerning the Bible. Amazing, isn't it!!!
Assume you had heart disease. The reason you have it is because you do not eat right, you do not exercise and you drink too much. Then you have a massive heart attack. Your heart is so damaged that there is no way you can survive unless you get a heart transplant. You sit in a hospital for 2 weeks wondering if you are going to die or whether you are going to get a new heart. Then a new heart is found and you get a transplant. All goes well and you recover.
After getting your new heart you take classes in the hospital about eating right and you do exercise everyday. You also learn about how drinking hurts your heart.
You feel great again (because your heart is working and you are exercising and eating right) and you get released from the hospital.
Then what? You then have a decision to make. You can either continue doing what is right (exercise, eat, etc) or you can return to your old ways and destroy your new heart. Which would you choose? I believe that I would choose to continue exercising and eating right. I would appreciate my new heart and now seeing what I did to destroy my old heart, I would not want to do those same things over again. If I did go back to the old way of living and if by doing that I destroyed my new heart, I would be called (rightly so) "foolish" by anyone who knew me.
"You foolish Galatians, ..." The whole theme of Galatians is returning to the old life and also returning to sin. The fact is sin destroys - not just our soul but also relationships, jobs, health, and so on. Why did I get baptized? Because I was sick and tired of sinning!!! I finally came face to face that sin had destroyed much of my life (over and above my soul). Sin is destructive. So, why is the sin list in Galatians 5? Just like returning to the law is stup_d (so I don't get spammed), returning to sin is also stup_d. Just like returning to the life style that destroyed my first heart would be foolish, so is returning to sin foolish.
This is the first time I have ever considered the "foolishness" of sin other than sin separates me from God. In Christ we are forgiven from ALL sins. But that forgiveness should not be a license to sin because sin is unhealthy. Sin hurts me (in more ways that just sending me to hell). God does not want us to get hurt. Thus, he does not want us (as christians) to sin because he does not want us to get hurt. The love of God surely does transcend all understanding. Reply to this
January 29, 2009 10:11 PM
Sam wrote:
Sorry Gentlemen....been spending all my spare time in preparation for the study this evening. Got up through verse 10 of chapter 1.
One verse in 5 here immediately disproves that often ssaid, often loved philosphy 'once saved, always saved'...And that's verse 21: "I warn you, AS I DID BEFORE, that those who live like this will NOT inherit the kingdom of God." (Emphasis mine). Reply to this
January 29, 2009 11:29 PM
Tony wrote:
22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. I feel like I have none of the above. I have been so out of sink the last couple of weeks. I have no joy, no patience, no peace, no self control. Satan knows the more we are out of the body and the word the deeper we get in the muck. I feel like I am in up to my eyeballs and sinking lower every day. 9 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy. I have left the ones that are obvious to me of me. I know who I am, do you know who you are? Without the support of other believers we cannot do this on our own. We must remain involved in the body and accountable to others. I have been accountable to no one, I have been involved with no one, I apologize to everyone. Reply to this
Galatians is finally making some sense to me. It is amazing to me how the Bible hits me at different times in my life. I can read the same passage or book every year and depending on circumstances at the time or other, what I take from my reading will change. The Bible truly is an amazing book - I firmly believe it is from God. And today I thank God for this gift that is able to teach us and guide us and help us when we need help (like always!!!).
I have learned from Galatians that I do not want to keep returning to what I used to do. I do not want to go back to rules and regulations. I instead want to move forward in my faith. I believe one of the hardest changes for me is to act out of love instead of out of duty or obligation. I am an obligation kind of guy. I go to work everyday because it is an obligation. Sometimes I think the main reason I have remained in my marriage for over 26 years is that I strongly believe in commitments. That is a good thing but it can also be a bad thing. The reason I should remain in my marriage is love not duty. Love is a much more effective and powerful motivator. I have noticed that as my marriage goes on and that as I mature and think more about these issues, I at least think about being motivated by love. I notice the same with God, however, as I said a few days ago, I have noticed also that stress and pressure in my life tends to drive me back to my old ways.
The last few verses in Galatians (that I have read numerous times) hit me very differently today. I want to be motivated by the spirit (by love for God) to not sin, not be motivated by fear or by the law. The law makes me aware of sin but actually as Paul says, sins are obvious. I do not need the law to know what offends God if I love God.
Today I am going to focus on being motivated by love instead of trying to do what is right and avoid doing what is wrong.
Reply to this
I agree with you - it's like Jesus is saying "You believe at last". Chapter 5 is a culmination of the theme for sure. It is basically saying that to be right with God, the key is not to focus on regulations and laws and a system. Now those of you who have been around awhile - is this not what the way the church was - not the extent of Galatians with their Judaic laws and celebrations, but it was through our dependence on authoritarian and hierarchical leadership (vs. the Spirit), numbers driven culture (vs. the Spirit), etc.
This is comparable to being in slavery - so that why many people were not happy ('what has happened to all your joy?).
It is interesting that he gives a sin list here. It is tempting to be legalistic when reading this. Here is a list - just check it off and you are ok. However, he preempts it by saying - hey sinful acts are obvious - you don't need a law to tell you about whether those are right or wrong - it is obvious. The way to overcome them? Focus on the Spirit. Keep in step with the Spirit. And the fruits of doing so are also obvious. The Christian Jews wanted to keep a system and set of laws to prove that they were right with God. Paul is saying - hey, you want to see who is right with God - look at the fruits of their lives. So do I exhibit the fruits of the Spirit? Some of them more than others, but self-control is probably the biggest weakness.
Reply to this
9"A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough."
How many times can any of you say that your faith has brought home the lost sheep of this world? i can honestly answer none. But i am just learning my faith and i am going to start searching for the lost sheep.
16So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature.
Live through the power of God and obey his commands and we will be able to resist sin. It's not easy to resist sin but with the help of our brothers and sisters and God we can overcome our downfalls.
22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
When we all get to the point were we can resist/overcome sin this is how our lives will be.
I am waiting on a call from Rick to find out if Tom Brown is going to okay my baptism for Sunday during the service. If it is ok'd i want to invite all of you to the service and my baptism. More information will follow once all plans are set.
Again if my opinions are off please let me know. I really want to make sure that i am on the right track.
Reply to this
Wow. You have really come a long way, Dustin. I am really happy for you, and you are making a great decision.
Reply to this
This whole circumcision thing has always confused me. It must have been a big deal with Jewish custom. It is not such a big deal in our society today, but I think you could replace this custom and insert another in its place, one we struggle with today, and get an understanding of the heart behind what Paul is trying to say. Christening children, maybe? Or God parents? I think these are things that our society does today that takes away from the message of the cross. The only difference is these were never a part of God's Law like circumcision was. I am struggling to think of any other parallels for todays divisions. Do you guys have any ideas?
Btw, I am still having a difficult time getting over this stomach thing. Lots of aches and pains, fatigue and unsettled stomach. day 5. please pray.
Reply to this
(LIGHT BUL
11Brothers, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished.
Brothers, if I am still preaching MY OLD WAY OF LIFE, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the WHOLE POINT OF THE CROSS has been WIPED OUT.
This thought also ties in with the sinful nature/spirit thing also. He is trying to get them to understand the pointlessness of returning to you old life.
Reply to this
I actually had what I think is a deep thought today concerning the Bible. Amazing, isn't it!!!
Assume you had heart disease. The reason you have it is because you do not eat right, you do not exercise and you drink too much. Then you have a massive heart attack. Your heart is so damaged that there is no way you can survive unless you get a heart transplant. You sit in a hospital for 2 weeks wondering if you are going to die or whether you are going to get a new heart. Then a new heart is found and you get a transplant. All goes well and you recover.
After getting your new heart you take classes in the hospital about eating right and you do exercise everyday. You also learn about how drinking hurts your heart.
You feel great again (because your heart is working and you are exercising and eating right) and you get released from the hospital.
Then what? You then have a decision to make. You can either continue doing what is right (exercise, eat, etc) or you can return to your old ways and destroy your new heart. Which would you choose? I believe that I would choose to continue exercising and eating right. I would appreciate my new heart and now seeing what I did to destroy my old heart, I would not want to do those same things over again. If I did go back to the old way of living and if by doing that I destroyed my new heart, I would be called (rightly so) "foolish" by anyone who knew me.
"You foolish Galatians, ..." The whole theme of Galatians is returning to the old life and also returning to sin. The fact is sin destroys - not just our soul but also relationships, jobs, health, and so on. Why did I get baptized? Because I was sick and tired of sinning!!! I finally came face to face that sin had destroyed much of my life (over and above my soul). Sin is destructive. So, why is the sin list in Galatians 5? Just like returning to the law is stup_d (so I don't get spammed), returning to sin is also stup_d. Just like returning to the life style that destroyed my first heart would be foolish, so is returning to sin foolish.
This is the first time I have ever considered the "foolishness" of sin other than sin separates me from God. In Christ we are forgiven from ALL sins. But that forgiveness should not be a license to sin because sin is unhealthy. Sin hurts me (in more ways that just sending me to hell). God does not want us to get hurt. Thus, he does not want us (as christians) to sin because he does not want us to get hurt. The love of God surely does transcend all understanding.
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Are you alright Mac?
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Sorry Gentlemen....been spending all my spare time in preparation for the study this evening. Got up through verse 10 of chapter 1.
One verse in 5 here immediately disproves that often ssaid, often loved philosphy 'once saved, always saved'...And that's verse 21: "I warn you, AS I DID BEFORE, that those who live like this will NOT inherit the kingdom of God." (Emphasis mine).
Reply to this
22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. I feel like I have none of the above. I have been so out of sink the last couple of weeks. I have no joy, no patience, no peace, no self control. Satan knows the more we are out of the body and the word the deeper we get in the muck. I feel like I am in up to my eyeballs and sinking lower every day.
9 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy. I have left the ones that are obvious to me of me. I know who I am, do you know who you are? Without the support of other believers we cannot do this on our own. We must remain involved in the body and accountable to others. I have been accountable to no one, I have been involved with no one, I apologize to everyone.
Reply to this