WOw...if you understand this chapter in Hebrews (7), you probably don't need to study any more of the Bible. Priests, old law, change to a new law, better convenent, save completely, perfect forever. This writer certainly jumped from elementary teachings (milk) right into maturity (solid foods)! How many people, I wonder, had even heard of this guy named Melchizedek until this letter was read to them? And what did he mean by his last statement: "For the law appoints as priests men who are weak.."? Weak in what way? Not having the capability as Jesus? Well, most certainly. But what a way to express this thought. I guess I would summarize this chapter as saying that we went from good to better, that is we (mankind who worship the true God in Heaven) originally had Melchizedek who was 'a god' to Abraham and to whom Abraham tithed, then we received Jesus who IS God, and to whom we should all tithe. We should be giving 10 percent of all we have, do and think, to Jesus. (And in my opinion, not necessarily 'the church organization') We should give our 'first fruits' of our time every morning to Jesus...that is, we should START our day with prayer and studying and meditating on God's Word. FIRST fruits, not mid-mornings, or afternoons, or evenings. Get what I'm saying. Maybe ya'll do this...get up and pray, and read and study and memorize and meditate...if so, GREAT. I know this type of 'first fruit' starts my day out a lot better. Sure, I am tired when I start out each morning in the Bible, but by the time I finish, I am rejuvenated, and much better prepared to face the day. I wonder how Melchizedek started his day. The Bible doesn't say, but I'll bet he started off by worshipping God in some manner. We all know Jesus started his days (at least some of them) early in prayer. He didn't need to study God's Word, He WAS God's Word. He gave ALL His time to God, not just the 10% of it. If we are to strive to be like our master, should we not try to give more to God than we are?
Well, enough for now....off to the salt mines. Reply to this
January 12, 2009 9:06 AM
Johnbob wrote:
Good challenge about mornings - this isn't a strength of mine especially in terms of prayer. I need to change that.
In terms of this chapter, I am sure that if we were Jewish, it would be easier to figure out. So it follows the theme of Jesus is greater than the angels, greater than Moses, greater than Melchizedek and even Abraham. He is even part of a new and better agreement (covenant) between God and His people (don't need any priests or sacrifices anymore), and Jesus is even the fulfillment of the old covenant in terms of being the perfect sacrifice.
So in every way, it's all about Jesus. Reply to this
January 12, 2009 8:59 AM
Johnbob wrote:
25Therefore he is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them.
This is a great scripture. Jesus always lives to intercede for us. This is his purpose. It ties in with the other scriptures in Hebrews about having a relationship with God - that we should be confident when we approach the throne. This is why, because we have a perfect high priest who has made the perfect sacrifice. Reply to this
January 12, 2009 9:33 AM
Johnbob wrote:
And by the way, the 'diet' did ok but not great yesterday. I was out with Beda and we went by a Barnes and Noble with a Starbucks in it, and without thinking, I got a hot chocolate. I had two cookies at night. Though at the pot luck, I had no soft drink and no dessert. So my plan/commitment for now is to cut out soft drinks and desserts (though maybe 1 day a week I can have some?). I also will cut back on snacking on bad things during the day (sweets/chips) - and snack on fruit if I am hungry. Let's start there and see where that leads.
Daniel, if you are reading this, what are some of the things you did to lose weight? How hard was it? What were some of the obstacles? Reply to this
January 12, 2009 9:37 AM
rik wrote:
"Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.
20 And blessed be God Most High, who delivered your enemies into your hand." Then Abram gave him a tenth of everything.
the only mention of Mel outside of Hebrews is in gen 14 and the above is what he states. I see the reverence Abe has for the high priest of the time and the high priest sees the love Abe has for God by his obedience. I think the Hebrew writer wants us to realize how much more we should have love for God because our High priest is the Son of God and Jesus stand before God and says: "Blessed be (insert your name here) by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.
20 And blessed be God Most High, who delivered your enemies into your hand."
to make matters more awe dropping, you look at the weakness of the OT high Priest, he was with sin. Our high priest has no sin of his own. Abe had to trust someone who may not have had completely pure motives, someone who had to offer up sacrifices for his own issues before he could deal with Abe's requests. We have the perfect High priest, how fortunate we are! Reply to this
January 12, 2009 10:12 AM
Rich wrote:
I agree with Mac and JB - this is a difficult chapter for a non-Jew to understand. And I guess, as Mac suggests, since I do not understand this chapter, I guess I will just have to keep studying the Bible. In fact, reading this chapter should convince us all that we need to study. Sometimes, confusion is a good thing!
However, I find it fascinating that the writer of Hebrews is essentially "doing a proof." I remember doing proofs in math - proving theories using other theories, associations or corollaries. I was never great at proofs. Some seemed to "stretch" things a bit too much for me. Similar to Heb 7:9-10 - "One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham, because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor." Seems to be stretching it a bit to me.
Nonetheless, the Hebrews writer, as JB says, firmly establishes the point the Jesus is greater than any human priest. Jesus is the perfect priest - the only one who could be a perfect priest. Regardless of how this proof is made, it is true and the consequence of us accepting this fact is total forgiveness and salvation.
The grace and blessings of God are so awesome. As Rik also saw in today, I do not think that I thank God enough for his love and mercy. I get too wrapped up in daily problems and issues to keep my focus on God. Thank you God for your patience and understanding. Reply to this
January 12, 2009 10:22 AM
Tony wrote:
3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God he remains a priest forever. Is this person greater than Jesus? We know Jesus had a mother,that would be Mary, and we know He had a beginning and a worldly death. What about this king? King of righteousness, king of peace. Who is this early savior, or is that just what the people said about him? It is interesting that he is a direct comparison to Jesus, from his name to his genealogy. Is Jesus the first of His kind or the second? Was Melchizedeka trail run? To many questions and not enough time this morning, I goggled the name and I will look more into it tonight Reply to this
January 12, 2009 3:27 PM
Rich wrote:
Everyone (except me) was sick in the house yesterday. Kids went to school today, but definitely not 100%. BJ has been in bed for past 3 days. It seems we are all passing illness back and forth. Would appreciate all prayers. Also, would appreciate prayers for my son. He has 2 exams that he must pass to be allowed to play soccer this spring. If he is not allowed to play I am afraid he will shut down completely. He takes tests today and tomorrow. Spanish and English. Thanks. Reply to this
January 12, 2009 5:29 PM
Dustin wrote:
I Dont know if this will help but i found it on Wikipedia. many different translations there from christian,Jewish, mormon, etc.
Hebrews 7:3 creates some confusion between denominations regarding Melchizedek's nature and background. This is how it stands in the KJV, describing Melchizedek as:
"Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually."
Different denominations interpret this in vastly different ways. Some say that Melchizedek is literally like the Son of God (or even is the Son of God) in that he has no father or mother. Others say that he has been adopted into Christ's lineage through the Lord's suffering, [10] still others claim that the verse has been mistranslated, and that the Priesthood Melchizedek held is what is without lineage, not Melchizedek. [11] Others claim that the verse merely represents Melchizedek's not being a priesthood holder because of lineage (i.e. "without descent" meaning not a descendent of Levi as required by Mosaic Law.)[12] Reply to this
192--bad weekend for enchiladas.
WOw...if you understand this chapter in Hebrews (7), you probably don't need to study any more of the Bible. Priests, old law, change to a new law, better convenent, save completely, perfect forever. This writer certainly jumped from elementary teachings (milk) right into maturity (solid foods)! How many people, I wonder, had even heard of this guy named Melchizedek until this letter was read to them? And what did he mean by his last statement: "For the law appoints as priests men who are weak.."? Weak in what way? Not having the capability as Jesus? Well, most certainly. But what a way to express this thought.
I guess I would summarize this chapter as saying that we went from good to better, that is we (mankind who worship the true God in Heaven) originally had Melchizedek who was 'a god' to Abraham and to whom Abraham tithed, then we received Jesus who IS God, and to whom we should all tithe. We should be giving 10 percent of all we have, do and think, to Jesus. (And in my opinion, not necessarily 'the church organization') We should give our 'first fruits' of our time every morning to Jesus...that is, we should START our day with prayer and studying and meditating on God's Word. FIRST fruits, not mid-mornings, or afternoons, or evenings. Get what I'm saying. Maybe ya'll do this...get up and pray, and read and study and memorize and meditate...if so, GREAT. I know this type of 'first fruit' starts my day out a lot better. Sure, I am tired when I start out each morning in the Bible, but by the time I finish, I am rejuvenated, and much better prepared to face the day.
I wonder how Melchizedek started his day. The Bible doesn't say, but I'll bet he started off by worshipping God in some manner. We all know Jesus started his days (at least some of them) early in prayer. He didn't need to study God's Word, He WAS God's Word. He gave ALL His time to God, not just the 10% of it. If we are to strive to be like our master, should we not try to give more to God than we are?
Well, enough for now....off to the salt mines.
Reply to this
Good challenge about mornings - this isn't a strength of mine especially in terms of prayer. I need to change that.
In terms of this chapter, I am sure that if we were Jewish, it would be easier to figure out. So it follows the theme of Jesus is greater than the angels, greater than Moses, greater than Melchizedek and even Abraham. He is even part of a new and better agreement (covenant) between God and His people (don't need any priests or sacrifices anymore), and Jesus is even the fulfillment of the old covenant in terms of being the perfect sacrifice.
So in every way, it's all about Jesus.
Reply to this
25Therefore he is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them.
This is a great scripture. Jesus always lives to intercede for us. This is his purpose. It ties in with the other scriptures in Hebrews about having a relationship with God - that we should be confident when we approach the throne. This is why, because we have a perfect high priest who has made the perfect sacrifice.
Reply to this
And your weight this AM?
Reply to this
And by the way, the 'diet' did ok but not great yesterday. I was out with Beda and we went by a Barnes and Noble with a Starbucks in it, and without thinking, I got a hot chocolate. I had two cookies at night. Though at the pot luck, I had no soft drink and no dessert. So my plan/commitment for now is to cut out soft drinks and desserts (though maybe 1 day a week I can have some?). I also will cut back on snacking on bad things during the day (sweets/chips) - and snack on fruit if I am hungry. Let's start there and see where that leads.
Daniel, if you are reading this, what are some of the things you did to lose weight? How hard was it? What were some of the obstacles?
Reply to this
"Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.
20 And blessed be God Most High, who delivered your enemies into your hand."
Then Abram gave him a tenth of everything.
the only mention of Mel outside of Hebrews is in gen 14 and the above is what he states. I see the reverence Abe has for the high priest of the time and the high priest sees the love Abe has for God by his obedience. I think the Hebrew writer wants us to realize how much more we should have love for God because our High priest is the Son of God and Jesus stand before God and says:
"Blessed be (insert your name here) by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.
20 And blessed be God Most High, who delivered your enemies into your hand."
to make matters more awe dropping, you look at the weakness of the OT high Priest, he was with sin. Our high priest has no sin of his own. Abe had to trust someone who may not have had completely pure motives, someone who had to offer up sacrifices for his own issues before he could deal with Abe's requests. We have the perfect High priest, how fortunate we are!
Reply to this
I agree with Mac and JB - this is a difficult chapter for a non-Jew to understand. And I guess, as Mac suggests, since I do not understand this chapter, I guess I will just have to keep studying the Bible. In fact, reading this chapter should convince us all that we need to study. Sometimes, confusion is a good thing!
However, I find it fascinating that the writer of Hebrews is essentially "doing a proof." I remember doing proofs in math - proving theories using other theories, associations or corollaries. I was never great at proofs. Some seemed to "stretch" things a bit too much for me. Similar to Heb 7:9-10 - "One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham, because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor." Seems to be stretching it a bit to me.
Nonetheless, the Hebrews writer, as JB says, firmly establishes the point the Jesus is greater than any human priest. Jesus is the perfect priest - the only one who could be a perfect priest. Regardless of how this proof is made, it is true and the consequence of us accepting this fact is total forgiveness and salvation.
The grace and blessings of God are so awesome. As Rik also saw in today, I do not think that I thank God enough for his love and mercy. I get too wrapped up in daily problems and issues to keep my focus on God. Thank you God for your patience and understanding.
Reply to this
3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God he remains a priest forever. Is this person greater than Jesus? We know Jesus had a mother,that would be Mary, and we know He had a beginning and a worldly death. What about this king? King of righteousness, king of peace. Who is this early savior, or is that just what the people said about him? It is interesting that he is a direct comparison to Jesus, from his name to his genealogy. Is Jesus the first of His kind or the second? Was Melchizedeka trail run? To many questions and not enough time this morning, I goggled the name and I will look more into it tonight
Reply to this
Everyone (except me) was sick in the house yesterday. Kids went to school today, but definitely not 100%. BJ has been in bed for past 3 days. It seems we are all passing illness back and forth. Would appreciate all prayers. Also, would appreciate prayers for my son. He has 2 exams that he must pass to be allowed to play soccer this spring. If he is not allowed to play I am afraid he will shut down completely. He takes tests today and tomorrow. Spanish and English. Thanks.
Reply to this
Si, Haré.
Yes, will do.
Reply to this
I Dont know if this will help but i found it on Wikipedia. many different translations there from christian,Jewish, mormon, etc.
Hebrews 7:3 creates some confusion between denominations regarding Melchizedek's nature and background. This is how it stands in the KJV, describing Melchizedek as:
"Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually."
Different denominations interpret this in vastly different ways. Some say that Melchizedek is literally like the Son of God (or even is the Son of God) in that he has no father or mother. Others say that he has been adopted into Christ's lineage through the Lord's suffering, [10] still others claim that the verse has been mistranslated, and that the Priesthood Melchizedek held is what is without lineage, not Melchizedek. [11] Others claim that the verse merely represents Melchizedek's not being a priesthood holder because of lineage (i.e. "without descent" meaning not a descendent of Levi as required by Mosaic Law.)[12]
Reply to this