October 24, 2007 5:21 AM
Sam wrote:
Prov 24:7. "Wisdom is too high for a fool; in the assembly at the gate he has nothing to say." I have been in plenty of situations where I lack wisdom, but wish I had had some, as I had nothing of value to input. One event comes to mind in particular. A few years ago, I went to a Defense Information Infrastructure Common Operating Environment (DII COE) Seminar. I was unprepared. They talked so far over my head, I THINK they were standing on Mount Rushmore and I was at the bottom of the Grand Canyon. Talk about being a fool and having absolutely no input, qalified input, anyway. Ya see, a fool is not just someone who acts foolish. This noun in the Bible is used several times to describe people who are uninformed or ignorant of certain things. We can be fools when it comes to knowing our Bible, as well. When we get together to discuss it, and the many wonders contained within, I don't like to be a fool and be totally uninformed about its contents. That is why I read and study. SO, when we DO get together "in the assembly at the gate", I will have something to say. Wisdom can be obtained by ANYONE, even a fool if he changes his ways. We were ALL foolish at one time when it comes to understanding God; and we seem to grow less foolish every time we read and share our thoughts.
Zech 8. WOW! Isn't God wonderful? Here He promised bliss to the Jews as they (and He) return to Jerusalem. He speaks of old men and women joyously enjoying seeing their grand children playing in the streets. He promises good crops and "to do good again to Jerusalem". He says the fasts to which they hold firm will be 'glad occasions', not those of pain and suffering and sadness. Many beleive these passages are referring to the coming of Jesus (v23), and they may well be doing that, but I think He is simply talking about THEIR time, and that there will be someone within their midst THEN which they will follow because that person is a man of God. Jesus came to earth for only a short period of time, as a man. None of us were privileged to have been 'here' at the time, but we do have the privilege of knowing that we can still follow Him. The people of Zechariah's time (around 400 years before the coming of Christ) did not have Him yet, so God, in His infinite wisdom, made Jews HIS people and made them leaders of the world, spiritually. When he talks about "one Jew by the him", he is referring to 'any' one Jew who will be envied and followed by non-Jews (all nations), and that 'one' Jew will lead them toward God. He is not identifying just one Jew, but in reality, is identifying that ALL Jews will be capable of leading Gentiles. And I am so glad He did, as I, not being a Jew, can grab the hem of the ONE JEW in our history, and be promised eternal life with God. We are so fortunate that God loves us sinners so. Reply to this
October 24, 2007 9:10 AM
Tony wrote:
Proverbs 24:29" Do not say, "I'll do to him as he has done to me; I'll pay that man back for what he did." How many times have we heard that two wrongs do not make a right? The thing I find interesting is that this is written in the old testament. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it an eye for an eye back in that day? Many times I can relate to mac's comment on being a fool with no knowledge. If you keep your mouth shut, people wonder if you are a fool, or you can open it and remove all doubt. Zechariah 7 Sounds like the people were going through the motions but had no conviction. I know a church that was like that ,and where are they now, scattered like the wind. Now I know how the desert came about, vs 14. Zechariah 8 The Lords is giving them everything back! Life, prosperity, hope his blessings and securities. He asked a question, and I did not see an answer. Vs 6 " This is what the LORD Almighty says: "It may seem marvelous to the remnant of this people at that time, but will it seem marvelous to me?" declares the LORD Almighty." I think the answer is how we (they) respond to the blessing that God has given them. God gives and gives, and what does He get in return? I know when I give and give and get nothing in return I can become distant and angry. We know what happens when the Lord has had enough, things go terrible wrong. I don't want to see the wrath of God in my lifetime. Reply to this
October 24, 2007 11:13 AM
Rich wrote:
Zech 7 and 8: Much here about God focusing on the heart as opposed to the actions. I see many parallels to the New Testament teachings of Jesus. Zech 7:9-10 - "Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another. Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the alien or the poor. In your hearts, do not think evil of each other." Sounds like something Paul once said.
Zech 8: 16-17 - "These are the things you are to do: Speak the truth to each other, and render true and sound judgement in your courts; do not plot evil against your neighbor, and do not love to swear falsely. I hate all this, declares the Lord."
These are actions that stem from our hearts. If our hearts are correct, we will do these things. It is amazing how easy it is for us to "do" instead of to "be." God wants us to love him above all else and to love others as ourselves. If we do this, the rest will come naturally. Do I really love God with all my heart, mind, soul and strength? Is my Bible study an act of love or an act of duty? I am not sure, but chapters like these scare me. Tony, I agree with you. I also do not want to see God's wrath in my lifetime. No matter what I think has been bad or difficult in my life, it is nothing compared to God's wrath. I pray for a pure heart that pleases God. Reply to this
October 24, 2007 2:17 PM
rik wrote:
I think it can be some of both, love and duty. the love times are for exactly that, love for God. the duty times are out of respect for God. I do not always feel like reading the bible but out of a duty to God or respect I will anyways. granted the love times are way more enlightening for me but I can still get something out of a "duty read" also. It is when I do not read at all that I gain nothing. there is no value at all in gaining nothing. Reply to this
October 24, 2007 11:31 AM
Rich wrote:
Prov 24:10 - True strength comes from my relationship with God. When I am close to God and relying on Him, I am strong. By myself, I am weak.
Reading this verse makes me realize why I have been faltering of late. I have been trying to deal with some recent troubles with my health, work and wife on my own. I am not depending on God for my strength.
Vs 32: "I applied my heart to what I observed and learned a lesson from what I saw." Oh, how much better my life would be if I made this verse the basis of my life. I have always prayed for wisdom. I just now realized that God has given me a lifetime of opportunity to gain wisdom by all that I have been through, but I have missed much of the opportunity by not applying my heart to things I have observed or learning lessons from what I have seen. I am the guy in the boat praying to God to be rescued, but refusing help offered because I did not see the help as being from God. I think God offers everything that happens as an opportunity for us to gain wisdom and understanding. Reply to this
October 24, 2007 12:50 PM
rik wrote:
p24 3-4 how do we build our house? what do we fill it with? wisdom and understanding are a very strong foundation and walls. wisdom the brick and understanding the morter. fill our rooms with knowledge and our house will stand a long time, do it not and surely we will parish.
October 24, 2007 7:01 PM
Sam wrote:
Ok...?????? Is that all we get from you on this???? C'mon man, put some LOVE into it. Love for us...SHARE what you got from this...I KNOW ya got something!!! Reply to this
Prov 24:7. "Wisdom is too high for a fool; in the assembly at the gate he has nothing to say." I have been in plenty of situations where I lack wisdom, but wish I had had some, as I had nothing of value to input. One event comes to mind in particular. A few years ago, I went to a Defense Information Infrastructure Common Operating Environment (DII COE) Seminar. I was unprepared. They talked so far over my head, I THINK they were standing on Mount Rushmore and I was at the bottom of the Grand Canyon. Talk about being a fool and having absolutely no input, qalified input, anyway. Ya see, a fool is not just someone who acts foolish. This noun in the Bible is used several times to describe people who are uninformed or ignorant of certain things. We can be fools when it comes to knowing our Bible, as well. When we get together to discuss it, and the many wonders contained within, I don't like to be a fool and be totally uninformed about its contents. That is why I read and study. SO, when we DO get together "in the assembly at the gate", I will have something to say. Wisdom can be obtained by ANYONE, even a fool if he changes his ways. We were ALL foolish at one time when it comes to understanding God; and we seem to grow less foolish every time we read and share our thoughts.
Zech 8. WOW! Isn't God wonderful? Here He promised bliss to the Jews as they (and He) return to Jerusalem. He speaks of old men and women joyously enjoying seeing their grand children playing in the streets. He promises good crops and "to do good again to Jerusalem". He says the fasts to which they hold firm will be 'glad occasions', not those of pain and suffering and sadness. Many beleive these passages are referring to the coming of Jesus (v23), and they may well be doing that, but I think He is simply talking about THEIR time, and that there will be someone within their midst THEN which they will follow because that person is a man of God. Jesus came to earth for only a short period of time, as a man. None of us were privileged to have been 'here' at the time, but we do have the privilege of knowing that we can still follow Him. The people of Zechariah's time (around 400 years before the coming of Christ) did not have Him yet, so God, in His infinite wisdom, made Jews HIS people and made them leaders of the world, spiritually. When he talks about "one Jew by the him", he is referring to 'any' one Jew who will be envied and followed by non-Jews (all nations), and that 'one' Jew will lead them toward God. He is not identifying just one Jew, but in reality, is identifying that ALL Jews will be capable of leading Gentiles. And I am so glad He did, as I, not being a Jew, can grab the hem of the ONE JEW in our history, and be promised eternal life with God. We are so fortunate that God loves us sinners so.
Reply to this
Proverbs 24:29" Do not say, "I'll do to him as he has done to me; I'll pay that man back for what he did." How many times have we heard that two wrongs do not make a right? The thing I find interesting is that this is written in the old testament. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it an eye for an eye back in that day? Many times I can relate to mac's comment on being a fool with no knowledge. If you keep your mouth shut, people wonder if you are a fool, or you can open it and remove all doubt.
Zechariah 7
Sounds like the people were going through the motions but had no conviction. I know a church that was like that ,and where are they now, scattered like the wind. Now I know how the desert came about, vs 14.
Zechariah 8
The Lords is giving them everything back! Life, prosperity, hope his blessings and securities. He asked a question, and I did not see an answer. Vs 6 " This is what the LORD Almighty says: "It may seem marvelous to the remnant of this people at that time, but will it seem marvelous to me?" declares the LORD Almighty." I think the answer is how we (they) respond to the blessing that God has given them. God gives and gives, and what does He get in return? I know when I give and give and get nothing in return I can become distant and angry. We know what happens when the Lord has had enough, things go terrible wrong. I don't want to see the wrath of God in my lifetime.
Reply to this
Me either.
Reply to this
Zech 7 and 8: Much here about God focusing on the heart as opposed to the actions. I see many parallels to the New Testament teachings of Jesus. Zech 7:9-10 - "Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another. Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the alien or the poor. In your hearts, do not think evil of each other." Sounds like something Paul once said.
Zech 8: 16-17 - "These are the things you are to do: Speak the truth to each other, and render true and sound judgement in your courts; do not plot evil against your neighbor, and do not love to swear falsely. I hate all this, declares the Lord."
These are actions that stem from our hearts. If our hearts are correct, we will do these things. It is amazing how easy it is for us to "do" instead of to "be." God wants us to love him above all else and to love others as ourselves. If we do this, the rest will come naturally. Do I really love God with all my heart, mind, soul and strength? Is my Bible study an act of love or an act of duty? I am not sure, but chapters like these scare me. Tony, I agree with you. I also do not want to see God's wrath in my lifetime. No matter what I think has been bad or difficult in my life, it is nothing compared to God's wrath. I pray for a pure heart that pleases God.
Reply to this
I think it can be some of both, love and duty. the love times are for exactly that, love for God. the duty times are out of respect for God. I do not always feel like reading the bible but out of a duty to God or respect I will anyways. granted the love times are way more enlightening for me but I can still get something out of a "duty read" also. It is when I do not read at all that I gain nothing. there is no value at all in gaining nothing.
Reply to this
Prov 24:10 - True strength comes from my relationship with God. When I am close to God and relying on Him, I am strong. By myself, I am weak.
Reading this verse makes me realize why I have been faltering of late. I have been trying to deal with some recent troubles with my health, work and wife on my own. I am not depending on God for my strength.
Vs 32: "I applied my heart to what I observed and learned a lesson from what I saw." Oh, how much better my life would be if I made this verse the basis of my life. I have always prayed for wisdom. I just now realized that God has given me a lifetime of opportunity to gain wisdom by all that I have been through, but I have missed much of the opportunity by not applying my heart to things I have observed or learning lessons from what I have seen. I am the guy in the boat praying to God to be rescued, but refusing help offered because I did not see the help as being from God. I think God offers everything that happens as an opportunity for us to gain wisdom and understanding.
Reply to this
p24 3-4
how do we build our house? what do we fill it with? wisdom and understanding are a very strong foundation and walls. wisdom the brick and understanding the morter. fill our rooms with knowledge and our house will stand a long time, do it not and surely we will parish.
z-8
Ok...
Reply to this
Ok...?????? Is that all we get from you on this???? C'mon man, put some LOVE into it. Love for us...SHARE what you got from this...I KNOW ya got something!!!
Reply to this